Posted by
Waski_the_Squirrel on Tuesday, July 24, 2007 4:00:25 PM
Yesterday, I got a bit long-winded as I wrote about how to discuss issues. Responses to columns on Townhall range from the edifying to the inane to the cruel or useless. I don't seriously expect everyone to agree with me and I accept that one may hold beliefs that are the polar opposite of mine and hold them just as sincerely. What I do expect is to be able to discuss beliefs with such people reasonably and, in the end, agree to disagree.
Early in my blogging career, I wrote of a rural school called Squaw Gap and made the suggestion it should be closed. The teacher there obviously feels quite differently. We had a small exchange. Neither of us had our minds changed by the exchange, but we now understand each other better. Isn't that the point of discussing issues?
Most of us are unlikely to change our views quickly, if at all. Yet we argue as though that is possible. Worse yet, we argue as theater. Imagine a political debate where one candidate shouts down the other who attempts to be polite. Who will be perceived as the winner?
A lot of people don't like watching reasoned debate. When I was in high school (my parents had TV) I enjoyed watching Charlie Rose and William F. Buckley on PBS because they always had intelligent, informative shows with varying viewpoints. I didn't always agree (particularly with the left-leaning Charlie Rose) but I liked watching because I could learn.
If you can't win a debate on reason and facts, start some theater. Nazis and Communists always ridiculed enemies. They shouted them down, humiliated them, sabotaged them, and made it impossible to actually discuss views. This is the same mentality as those self-righteous pigs that throw pies at Ann Coulter or protest loudly during speeches with which they disagree. Ann Coulter is a conservative example. She thrives on spectacle. In her defense, I have read enough of her writing to recognize that she is capable of reasoned debate.
That is my blog for today. The rest of this is examples from a few Townhall columns. My selection is small due to my time constraints. However, a quick visit to the columnist section of Townhall will reveal much more.
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Mike Adams wrote an article called
Life and How to Live it Part IX. It described the path of his maturation from a boy to a man. For one of his columns, it was remarkably free of politics. It described his growth from a boy who took pride in poor grades and planned a soccer career to a family man with the Ph.D. To read the comments, one would not see this.
The first few comments are quite polite and come from both sides of the political aisle. Then we get one from a mechanic who seems to believe Dr. Adam's choice not to be a mechanic is an insult to blue-collar workers everywhere. He seems to be looking for trouble.
Mike,
Mike, Mike... What's wrong with mechanics? Can you concede that there
are some folks driven to the profession of auto/truck mechanic? Or, is
that your idea of where someone 'ends-up' when they're out of options?
Mike,
I'm happy that you were able to chase your brass ring. But pal,
something desperate has happened to you in the last 60 days and it's
reflected in your writing style. Do you realize that you've insulted
every manual laborer who chances to read your column?
I think
I'm going to skip the next few, Mike, and hopefully by then your head
will be screwed back on straight. Good luck, and I sincerely hope
everything's okay at your end. |
A little further one, one of our right-wingers leaps in with a little sermon that seems disconnected from it all.
The
God of the Bible is sovereign over all of creation. He defines right
and wrong in His Law, the Ten Commandments, and is omnipotent,
omnipresent, omniscient in all things. He is not a helpless, wimpering,
effeminate being. He is not the creation of man's imagination or
deserving of pity. He demands awed reverence. The sovereignty of
God in the Scriptures is absolute, irresistible, infinite. He governs
the universe, which he made for His own glory, just as He pleases. He
has the right, as the Potter, to mold the clay, man, as He chooses. He
is under no rule or obligation to give an account of Himself to His
creatures.He gives mercy to whom He pleases, and it is not a right to
which man is entitled. Mercy is the attribute of God by which He pities
and relieves the wretched.The objects of God's mercy are those who
deserve punishment but instead, receive what they do not deserve. God
speaks to the meek, the wretched, the humble, the broken. He first
revealed His Son to shepherds and travellers from afar- two of the most
unlikely groups of people. The humble were singled out for great honor;
the learned and elite passed by. God gives His mercy to those whom He chooses, in grace and sovereignty, and often to the most unlikely and unworthy.
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Then someone had to throw in a military dig that (later on) proved to be Iraq related. This was in response to a column unrelated to Iraq or politics of any kind.
Looks like military service is another thing Mikey Adams "didn't want to do."
Chickenhawkism - the true legacy of the Bush administration! |
Then someone had to toss in a random dig at liberals. Apparently it was in response to another post.
|
what is the west coast? few people seem to have heard of the place- no wonder a lib has an audience -of deviates |
At some point during all of this, I spoke up. I suppose I was composing yesterday's blog in my head, though not yet aware of it.
This
is a nice little article about maturity and how accidents play into
that. It was not an attack on liberals or mechanics. Dr. Adams would
have been unhappy as a mechanic. I would have been unhappy with what I
did in high school as well.
Instead, everyone seems to want to
turn this into an attack. We get his military service analyzed, he is
accused of whining, and a variety of other insults are tossed in from
all over.
People are responding to the man and their feelings
toward him. They are not responding to what he wrote. It's almost as
though many of the comments are written before the article. |
Another poster quickly responded by insulting my squirrel nature. That biased me to believe that the rest of his post was about me. Fortunately, I'm calm. I reread it and recognized it was a continued insult toward Dr. Adam's military service. Another poster said something similar to me, and he responded to that one in the next post. I'm putting both here together.
Waski:
"Instead, everyone seems to want to turn this into an attack. We get
his military service analyzed, he is accused of whining, and a variety
of other insults are tossed in from all over."
If you're an
advocate of the war and you are of military age, you should be in
uniform. It's easy to pay poor mercenaries to fight your wars for you,
but if you wouldn't put your life on the line for a cause, why should
you have the temerity to risk someone else's? |
Husker1: "How do you get to these statements based on this article?" ------------------------------------------ You don't. But it's not like the guy hasn't been one of the most prolific Townhall bloggers. |
Quick change! The other article I wanted to use as an example was about the intelligence of first-born children relative to their other siblings. The author pointed out the premise of the study and also pointed out that these were broad statistical trends. Said more simply, there are exceptions. I'll only post a few responses to Dinesh D'Souza's
Why Firstborn Children are Smarter. I imagine my younger brother will not have read this article!
An amazing number of people wrote responses with anecdotal evidence that they believed proved him wrong. They don't understand broad trends. "Men like watching sports" is a broad trend. Are there exceptions? Yes.
One poster had to start on the insults.
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Not so in the case of my brother. He's a liberal. |
Another poster (who I will not quote due to length) got into a discussion of how statistics can say anything and should not be taken seriously. They were reasonable but did not explain what was wrong with this study. I can, however, accept it as a useful contribution.
Then we get some liberal bashing.
It
never ceases to amaze me how liberals can prattle on about
"overpopulation" on minute, and then declare humanity on the verge of
extinction. If there is one thing the human race is good at it is
survival and adapting to changing environments.
There are those
people in the world who do stuff, and those who complain about what
those who do stuff did. The fact that an intellectual hiccup such as
yourself is able to not only survive, but thrive, is a testament to the
genius of those around you who make your continued existence possible.
You should thank them, rather than find fault. |
One last article was Dennis Prager's piece on
animal cruelty. Once again, some genius tossed in military service.
of
sophisty many have come to expect from this most "undeserving" person,
who, at age 58 claims he was too young to serve in the military during
the Vietnam War.
He means too 'emotionally young'. What a novel excuse for a noxious draft-dodger and war-yellow.
And again, Denny has invoked Godwin's Law; the thread is finito--he loses the debate.
|
Unrelated, once again.
Reading through the columns, you can find much worse than I cared to post here. There are invitations to drink drano, comments that all religious people should be lined up and shot, suggestions of boiling homosexuals alive, and other such. From time to time, Townhall does remove comments and does not seem to be censoring.
Early in my posting career, I commented on an agriculture article and made the remark that current agriculture policy wasn't working because my classroom was steadily emptying out. An unpleasant woman responded by calling me a brainwasher, union member, and that I'd never met a government program I didn't like. Ironically, we both agreed on the article, but she didn't realize it. She saw the word "teacher" and was off. Her response was removed.